Kara 10/14

Horrible Run. I hope you all know that. I should not have to go into the reasons.
Grats Hawktranni on Gloves and Veloce on the Moonkin Bracers.
Karsis-Its been 3 weeks, learn to bless, learn to use Divine shield it wipes ANYTHING yes including a garrote that will kill u and screw us over.
Ianil- Why was your dps lower than mine?
Veloce-Good job healing, you made the run seem alot better than it really was.
Rogues- Why do rogues think that tanks can magically hold aggro from 20 yds away?
Hawktranni-your dps was barely higher than mine.
Ezmac-#1 dps again nice job
Wildellia- you dont check these forums...
Rva- Grats on being the first person to not showup w/o letting someone know


Now I made some mistakes on Moroes including not using blessing of sac on the offtank that did wipe us...
Let's please all be on time for the next raid, should be logging on before 5, you really should be in Duskwood at 5.
This is the one thing we do as a guild, so at least being there on time would help out.
I also need to ask, why aren't people running 5-mans more often? I am exalted with all the factions except Lower City and really have nothing to gain from normal 5-mans but I'll still go to help.

I'm not really sure, Moroes seems like a lost cause...are we really ready for Karazhan? Or should we have 5-mans instead?

Ok I just looked at Ianil's armory, I sent u gems and u still havent slotted your chestpiece, which has been without gems for a long time now.
So are some people putting in more effort than others? Yes, they are. Thats not really fair.

If people aren't ready, it would be best to run the five-mans and get them all caught up...or hopefully they'll be motivated to get caught up. I really hate sitting here with my hands tied behind my back unable to do anything...

Ok my original post contains alot of Frustration...now that I have had the chance to think about it I know what our biggest problem is.
The PuG's. Having to deal with them is just more than its worth.
So I want to step back, and do some 5-mans from now on. We will have a 2 5-man grps one nonheroic and heroic.

First we will do Karazhan and kill Attumen, repair at Koren and then portal back to Shattrath and do our 5-man's.

So here will be the groups for next Sunday:
Nonheroic SL:
Norelco
Grazny
Hawktranni
Rvakilla
Wildellia
Feel free to move on to SV afterwards if you'd like for Norelco's second fragment.

Heroic SL:
Relina
Ianil
Chevalier
Ezmac
Veloce (balance)
For the felguards that fear we gotta make sure that everyone stand on top of him because im sure they will kill ppl fast on heroic if you don't.
I've never done this instance on heroic im sure it'll be tough but nothing like a good challenge.


I would also like to extend this to twice a week eventually. The repair bills in Karazhan last week was not worth it, stepping backwards can help us move forward for the future. With 5-mans maybe we can have multiple scheduled times a week, but probably only one group going the other days.

No ez so im gonna have to figure out a slightly diff. setup

Wish I could run this Sunday gang. Have a family reunion/wake. No need for condolences, it will be a grand party, that's the way my family likes to be sent off to the afterlife.

I really want to run Kara tight, so let's keep posting and discussing to figure out strategies, etc.

Chev, what did you mean about rogues not understanding Tanks can hold agro from 20 yds away; please clarify and I will clean up what I can.

As for Moroes, I want that bad boy at some point, so here are my suggestions:

1) we need more dps, I think the two rogues we added were not up to the challenge.
2) Pulp and Graz will help. Graz can tank when respecced OR he can heal and Veloce can dps moonkin
3) I think that if we split a team to me, cloth dps and healer (if we can spare the heals); we can melt down one priest without a tank (I can stun, kick, cloakofshadows--talent that makes me immune to magic for 5 seconds, etc and basically tank) and then jump into the other mobs giving MT and OT time to build agro on the others.

Let's keep up the chatter.

I'm available for 5man, etc T,W,Th evening server time (after 7pm).

When the mob is stunned 20 yards ahead of where I want it positioned...if it's stunned I can't move it, If I have a few guys on me its a real pain...now I gotta concentrate on that mob, just pray that it'll go to me instead of running to someone else. So instead of focusing on other things like using blessing of sacrifice on the offtank or Holy Shielding/Cons. I gotta focus on this mob and see where he goes because the rogues/warriors charging etc. were too impatient to wait for it to get to me....its called splitting the pull and its really annoying.

I want to know whos gonna step up and help me out, other than Relina, who is the first one here to post, and isnt even playing. I asked you all and you all said you wanted to go to Karazhan, yet I am all alone trying to figure things out and nobody else is trying to organize anything. People come here and see this post and dont even take the effort to reply. I just don't know how long I can be doing this week by week, seeing who's going and who's not, calling Astu and seeing if he can go or not, leading the raid, and wondering why nothing goes on during the week anymore. Seeing people come back and then other people disappear, and putting so much into this character and still waiting to fully utilize its potential. Patience is a virtue and I believe I have alot of it but I have been waiting for months now. I got us into Kara, when we barely have enough people, and now all I ask is that people start to put a little more effort into this or I am out of here. I need help, if we truely all want to be doing Karazhan. Otherwise forget it, if you guys really don't care im doing this all for nothing, and id rather just try to enjoy the game. So im going to give it another week and see how it goes, my acct expires the 24th and then I can decide it I need a break or if I should just move on.

...yeah, I probably shouldn't post here so much since I can't even play the game right now, but I really don't want to lose tabs on what's going on with everyone. People really do need to be reading the forum, since not everyone can be on WoW every second of the day, but that's no excuse not to plan for anything. I don't want people giving up their real lives just to play WoW, but if you want to see more end game content, you do need to be geared for it. There's no shame in running instances for rep. I don't think those of us who did a lot of instance runs in the past (Chev, Ianil, Ezmac, Grazny, etc.) would work so well together now if not for all the times we wiped, and had to learn how to work things out. Anyone remember good old Scholomance? Or even Stratholme? I look back on them fondly now because we got so good at those places. (I'm sad there's no reason to return to them now.)

I do hope to see everyone this next month. I know it still seems far away, but in just over a month I'll be going home for the Thanksgiving break (an entire week!), and I'd love for nothing more than to run instances, quests, and raids with the guild again. (That's four more Sundays, people!)

Also, on that note, I do want to see Karsis at 70 before I return, because then we shouldn't need any pugs, or to make Grazny respec to heal for future raids.

Perhaps there is a fine line between taking a game too seriously and not taking it seriously enough. But I know which side of the line I'd rather fall on. Certainly, it is very frustrating to play a game that takes so much personal time, only to have a run turn out to be an inefficient use of that time due to people not taking the game seriously enough. But it's also frustrating to have one more thing in my life, a thing I oftentimes consider an escape from reality altogether, become as regimented and invasive as reality.

I play the game, and I think I play it ok. I'm not the best, my gear is mediocre, my skill level might be too, and frankly, so is my commitment to the game in general. So while I'm not enthused with how Moroes escaped, I'm not ready to start throwing out ultimatums. If you're really having overwhelming and incurable problems with how Sunday went, (and again, I agree some level of disappointment is merited), i.e. if it's really causing you to question whether playing the game is worth your personal time, I say save yourself the emotional energy and let your account expire. But if instead, you feel that you can have fun while rallying the troops for the next attempt (and here, I'll agree that mastering the 5 mans is a step in the right direction) then lead on. But please don't fool yourself into thinking you're going to win this fly with that vinegar. My "advice" is probably not the help you were looking for, but I really don't think this game should be causing you the heartache you seem to be suffering, and thus such advice seems appropriate.

And if you're wondering why nobody has replied it's probably because we flies resent the implication that there's something wrong with our level of commitment. I can only speak for myself, but I would more readily reply to a detached and analytical look at our run, with any comments directed at individuals made in a more neutral and productive tone. (To complete the analogy, I'd call that the "honey.")

I try my best to follow your leadership out of self interest; we each play this game for our own reasons; none of my reasons inlcude satisfying the personal ambitions of other people's characters.

While I was trekking around India I considered never playing WoW again. This was not a consideration taken lightly but one taken seriously in the context that I would be leaving the wide open world of school and entering the very limiting world of work.

I can only speak for myself, but I started work this week and I'm sure that my availability to the world in the future will be intermittent. However, after playing recently I do know that I want to keep playing and I would love it if I could schedule and regiment my playing...but I'm pretty sure that will soon become impossible given the nature of my job (sometimes no work at all, sometimes working 20 hours a day, all times being at the complete heel of someone else and a slave to their demands).

So, in light of Chev's comments I just wanted to paint a clear picture of my RL situation. I totally understand Chev's frustrations and I'm sorry Sunday in particular went so poorly. I think we can do better and I hope Chev is at least available to try again in the future. I know I personally love playing with you, Chev.

However, if the game is causing you as much grief as it appears, dude, chuck it. Come back if you want, those of us who remain (intermittently or with dogged dedication) I'm sure will be elated when you are there.

>>speaking of hiatus and returen, isn't it awesome to hear Wild's voice again?<<

Personally, that's why I love this game, for the "human" contact with all of you that I meet. Killing Moroes would be nice, too.

as always, I'm ez.

Alright...here's the plan...we're gonna drop Kara cause we're not ready for it/don't have enough people/just can't incorporate the randomness of PuGs.

So we will keep our initial group time at 2 Server on Sundays...this will now not change. From there, instead of just logging off afterwards I want to strongly encourage people to schedule some more runs for the rest of the week. 1 5-man per week it'll take awhile before we are ready to tackle Karazhan again. Goals in this 5-mans would be, to build solid teamwork, get some gear improvements and build up rep to start running Heroics. Heroics are very good for preparing for Karazhan and with patch 2.3 there is even better items than present checkout worldofraids.com, the gear available is of a very high item level. How to know if you should be doing a nonheroic or a heroic? If you are revered with a faction, then I want to try to get you into the heroic group. One thing that I am looking forward to in patch 2.3, is that there will be daily quests for both nonheroic and heroic dungeons, which will be random any given day. The heroic version will give 2 badges of justice and some gold, I dont know about the nonheroic version. Also, +10% stamina for me =D.

My problem wasn't really that we were not able to down Moroes, moreso (interesting this is Moroes scrambled...) I was getting tired of making sure that we would have the numbers to do Karazhan week after week. One person doesn't show up, and we get a poor drawing of pugs, and before you know it we are taking 5 minutes and 1 second to kill Attumen.

So what am I trying to say here...well I want to say I am sorry, and that my outburst was unjustified, and I need to understand that I cannot turn casual players into hardcore players just by getting angry.

Looking at dps charts was a very poor way to judge players and I should not have done that. This website wowwebstats.com gives a much more accurate description of what each player is doing. In fact, it kinda scares me how much it describes. So i'll run that from now on before making any statements (hey, I am a statistics major) that have alot of room for error.

I hope that this post will be satisfying to anyone that reads it. By the way, I have an officer rank just sitting around that I really want to give out to a person or two. This rank is reserved for the people that I see organizing events for the week after our Sunday runs and players that have gear setups with enchants/gems that I approve (because down the line, someday when we are clearing Karazhan, people will start looking at armories, and I want the guild to give a good impression, people will look at the highest ranked players first)

Apology accepted, and returned: my retort had the possibility of escalating problems rather than resolving them, so I'm glad you took my comments as they were intended. I agree with your battle strategy and look forward to a guild event.

I'll also echo Ezmac's statements - I really enjoy running with you and look forward to exploring the end game content with you. I also have time constraints similar to ez's for the foreseeable future, so as far as participation goes, it will depend...